College Teams Beating Pros? - Scoop Jackson
Scoop Jackson is an award winning sports writer and he is coming to ESPN’s page 2. He decided to introduce himself and it turned into a list of beliefs that Scoop has. I won’t go one by one or anything, but one line in particular just screams of utter stupidity and it happens to be one of the great sports debates that I have ever been involved with.
When the Bengals were the worst team in the NFL, it was very popular to say that the best college teams would have beaten them in a matchup. At the time I think it was the Miami Hurricanes.
Now, Scoop says this in his intro to ESPN Page 2.
“I believe USC with Mike Williams would have beat all but five NFL teams.”
Let me tell you something. This is not true. In fact USC with Mike Williams wouldn’t be able to beat a single NFL team. Not one. Not the Arizona Cardinals.
Here’s why.
USC might have a huge number of talented players on their roster, but how many of them will make it to the NFL? How many will make it to be starters in the NFL? Not a huge percentage.
How many players on the Arizona Cardinals will make it to the NFL? 100%
So, even if USC has 25 NFL caliber players on their roster, and 12 who will become NFL starters, they wouldn’t be able to compete with a bunch of guys who were the best of the best on their teams.
And this argument doesn’t even include the fact that NFL players work generally (on average) work out more than College Players and are therefore bigger and stronger, etc.
So, I look forward to reading some of Scoop’s stuff on Page 2, but this belief holds no water.
Comments
14 Responses to “College Teams Beating Pros? - Scoop Jackson”
Sideblog 
- FreeTheAirwaves.org Tuesday, 19 August 2008, 7:51 am
Google has a vested business interest in this project, but I am rooting for them anyway. Google wants to take that unused fuzzy space between TV channels and broadcast internet signals all over the. […] - Browns vs. Giants - Preseason Game 2 Live Blog at WFNY Monday, 18 August 2008, 4:19 pm
The nice guys over at Waiting for Next Year are going to be live-blogging their event in a chat room over at their site. I am a geek, and will be joining them. Come on over. - Dan Gilbert is My Hero Sunday, 10 August 2008, 5:46 am
Cleveland Cavaliers owner on all the LeBron James rumors, ”The reason this thing is where it’s at,” Gilbert said, ”is that we’ve got a bunch of bored, East Coast sports writers who have noth. […] - LeBron to Europe? I Don’t Think So Thursday, 7 August 2008, 4:22 am
So, while the major media continues to plot LeBron’s departure from Cleveland, there is a sane voice out there letting everyone know how unlikely the most outlandish scenarios truly are. - Top Gun 2???!?!?!??!?!? Wednesday, 23 July 2008, 5:50 am
According to reports, the plot outline is, (wait for it) “The idea is Maverick is at the Top Gun school as an instructor — and this time it is he who has to deal with a cocky new female pilot.” - Be Afraid Utah Tuesday, 22 July 2008, 7:26 am
Carlos Boozer is a snake and one of the most dishonorable people in professional sports history. I guess I am not over this just yet. - How much you wanna bet… Thursday, 3 July 2008, 9:18 pm
That this 4-day work week will actually increase the amount of gasoline that these employees will be using? Instead of commuting to work, they will now be going to the grocery store, going to do som. […] - In-Car DVD Players are Stupid Thursday, 26 June 2008, 10:15 am
At least they will be when we get a load of in-car wifi!!!!! (I am such a geek.) - George Carlin is Gone Monday, 23 June 2008, 4:34 am
I once bet a guy in college that I could watch a George Carlin special on HBO without laughing. I did it, but it wasn’t at all easy. There is going to be a void left by Carlin dying. - Accepted Behaviors Tend to Increase Thursday, 19 June 2008, 12:15 pm
If you become too accepting of a condition that you really don’t want to encourage, you might just end up with unintended consequences.
you’re right. The average line on an NFL team outweighs the line on USC by 30-40 lbs. per man. This would lead to Mike Williams being flattened by a 345 lb. defensive end after said defensive end ran over 2 tackles and a guard, all by himself. Anyone who tries to defend this douchebag is, themself, a douchebag.
While I think I agree with you, I think your argument is a bit flawed. Football isn’t math. You can’t take the average talent of every player on each team and say “Well, the average Arizona Cardinal is a shitty NFL player and the average USC Trojan is an above-average college player, thus the Cardinals are better, if only slightly.”
The team with the most mean talent doesn’t always win. Sometimes the team with the best player wins. See: Michael Jordan, any college basketball team from the last 25 years, etc.
That said, would I be stunned to death if USC beat the 49ers? No. But I would be surprised.
Having watched a few MIT football games, I can tell you that the situation where your linemen are the same size as the other team’s backs is not good.
I’d love to watch a USC-any NFL team game, but that’s because I like watching small things get smashed by large things.
Justin, I think the biggest difference between college and the pros is the play at the line. The skill players at QB, RB, WR, TE, etc, can compete anywhere if they have some skills, but on the line of scrimmage is where the pros are going to really make USC look silly. How many sacks do you think the Cardinals would have against USC’s offensive line?
I agree with you, Justin. You can’t take the average talent and make a direct ratio. You can, however, take the average weight and size and make a direct ratio. As previously stated, the fight in the trenches wouldn’t be much of a fight at all. It would be a massacre. Example : the OSU champion team of 2003. Only one (1) (I) guy from that line made it pro, Alex Stepanovich (out of Berea, OH nonetheless) and he plays for the Arizona Cardinals. Game, set, match. wait that’s tennis.
Like I said, I agree with Craig’s point, which is that 999 times out of 1000, USC would get trounced against NFL teams. [And the reason I agree is because of football matchups like the offensive lines. Also, special teams and linebackers. But I digress.]
I just disagree with his argument in the original writing, which was that of Cardinals Mean Talent defeating USC’s Mean Talent. While this would definitely be the case in a game of strat-o-matic, actual football is played on actual fields. And crazy shit sometimes happens.
Also, as long as I am talking about averages, I have gathered the following information
USC Offensive Line
Mean Height: 6′4.2″
Mean Weight: 322 lbs
Arizona Cardinals Offensive Line
Mean Height: 6′4.8″
Mean Weight: 329 lbs
[NOTE: Official listed heights and weights are generally fibbed in both college and the pros for one reason or another. But I have nothing to go on but these numbers, which were gathered from rivals.com for the college stuff and ourlads.com for the pro stuff.]
Also, those numbers are for only starting offensive linemen.
Criag, I believe you asked me the Hurricanes-Benglas questions a few years ago in regards to your friend Dan. I enjoyed the argument so much that I saved the exact email I sent to him. (10/31/2002) Here it is:
” Dan,
Here is why you are completely fucking wrong. Not even a little bit right. Speed might be the only thing college players have equal to pros, but speed will not get you shit.
First, although you were 350 lbs in college, the average weight in the NFL, especially on the lines is much higher in the NFL. Weight training regimens lead to much bigger, stronger athletes that would crush a college team.
Second, last year’s Hurricanes might have been the best college team ever, yet only had 9 pros on a 53 man roster. I know this is a tough concept, but the Bengals have 53 pros, and would have gladly taken the tenth guy on Miami if it would have helped there team. The Bengals offensive and defensive line would destroy Miami. Their linebackers would be in the backfield every play. Thats why they dont run the pussy option in the pros. Because pros are too fast for that shit. It is a completely different level. Take the 10,000 D-I football players and only take the top 10%.
Third, your one game theory is just plain fucking wrong. This isnt baseball or hockey, where chance comes into play. A mismatch in football will always go to the better team. No 60-pt underdogs ever wins, ever! A thats what Miami would be.
Fourth, the Bengals would play that game like their dicks were being threathened to be cut off. Corey Dillon would rush for 1000 yards.
Lastly, while a guy like Bryant McKinnie might be better than every offensive lineman on the Bengals, hes the only one. I challenge you to name the other four o-lineman on the Hurricanes last year. You cant cause they were not close to professional.
You are wrong. Dont argue. Just say you are sorry and stop this nonsense.
Chris D.”
I remember this whole argument, but didn’t save transcripts of my rebuttals, because honestly it wasn’t to frigging important to me. The fact it is still being brought up 2 years later is re-god-damned diculos!
“I remember this one time I made a good point when I was 15 in a WWF chatroom….I saved the transcripts because it shows that I am super Boss!!!”
I hope I speak for everyone when I say…..Grow up, and stop being such a homo!
Once and for all I will answer why I believe a college team on the right day under the right circumstances with the proper healthy personel could defeat a professional team.
First off, if you research the best offensive line in the NFL right now (The Denver Broncos)you’ll see that they are far smaller than the average NFL O-line. Yet they execute and have spectacular fundamentals. They have had 3 runningbacks in 3 seperate years run for over 1600 yards….Hmmm, is size really that important?
Second? If you tell me that the Patriots have more talent than some of the teams they have beat in their past 3 seasons of supremacy I will question if you have ever watched an NFL game. They have a plan that they execute with maximum efficency, regardless of who they are playing their execution helps overcome speed, size, and strength disadvantages.
The “one game theory” is what sports are all about, if this theory was never possible, why would we play games? We would just weigh the teams, have them bench press and run 40yd dashes and the overall winners would be declared champions. Your way of thinking would reduce all sports to a track and field day in elementary school.
If the one game theory is too much of an intangible how could you claim the Bengals would play like their dicks were on the line….who knows how they would react, would they care? No one Knows….
Again, this argument is 2 years old and is completely ridiculos. I almost didn’t respond because I don’t want to be on this asshats list of people to kill written in his moms lipstick.
Seriously dude, who keeps transcripts of 2-3 year old emails? Then replys with them at oppritune moments on weblogs 2 years later to help make a point???
Re: the Patriots’ talent level. I don’t know if they have more or less total talent than the teams they beat, but I do think it’s spread around better. I will not bore you with a recitation of my salary cap management thesis.
USC could beat any NFL-europe team, hands down. Can we call it quits now?
Hey Deezo,
You got me. Hotmail auto-archives my email. I must be the only one. Im gonna call them and tell them to stop.
First of all, Craig brought this argument up again and it just dawned on me that I have had that sports argument with a few people including you. Thats it. Was it dick to post that email? Probably. Do I care? No.
Obviously you still have not learned because you are still defending your ridiculous point. There is a difference between a pro and a non-pro, size being only one of the major differences. The one-game theory is wrong in this context, too. But theres no use explaining it to you.
Chris D.
i feel a cage match coming on.